S2 Ep 5: Meet Reed Amber

**This episode contains explicit content of a sexual nature. There is also a lot of swearing so you may not want to play this where young ears could be listening. **

In this episode Jennie and Damian talk to Reed Amber who is a sex-positive mental health advocate, nudity, kinks and fetishes anti-shamer.

Reed tells us about herself and the sex positive work she does and how her aim is to talk about subjects that some people may feel uncomfortable discussing.  She talks about the positives and negatives that there are when being so open on social media.

Reed also gives a very open look in to her life including mental health issues and drug addiction.

Transcript

Audio recording: 0:10

Welcome to Enhance the UK Undressing Disability podcast where we strip back all things taboo on sex and disability.

Jennie Williams: 0:26

Hello, and welcome to a new episode. Damien and I are so excited to be talking to the lovely Reed Amber, who is a sex, nudity and mental health anti shamer. Hello Reed. Thank you for joining us today. And before we start Reed, could you just give us an audio description of yourself for all our listeners, please?

Reed Amber: 0:49

Hello. It's such a pleasure to be here. So I am a young female wearing a yellow top that says Endure and Survive. I'm also part of the glasses gang right now. And my hair is probably the most recognised part about me, is the two tone effect. You know, Cruella DeVil desired, where half of my fringe is brown, my natural colour, and the other half is white. And I've recently just dyed my whole whole hair white. So Woo,

Jennie Williams: 1:20

It is a very distinctive look. I love it. When did you first start doing the half and half with the fringe?

Reed Amber: 1:26

I think that was probably about five years ago. And I'd had a bob with a fringe for maybe the past 10 years, something mad. I've had this hairstyle for a long time. And I was just getting bored of it. And then Cruella DeVil inspiration. She's a badass bitch. And so yeah, bleached my streak in my fringe, and then all my hair was brown. And then I just recently done the flip reverse. So the inverse of it this year. It has been quite fun. I mean, I feel like everyone needs to bleach or dye their hair at some point in their life. If you can, do it because it's just a little bit of fun. Worst case scenario, just cut it all off.

Jennie Williams: 2:13

I've bleached and dyed my hair. I mean, if anyone could see this, they'd be glad that they're on a podcast because it's dying, it's absolutely gross. You're very well known for lots of reasons but can you just tell us a little bit about what you do? And you've got a lovely big following on Instagram as well, and tell us about tell us about yourself.

Reed Amber: 2:37

Oh, thank you. That's so lovely. So I've dubbed myself a sex, nudity and mental health anti shamer. So that's where my expertise lie, pushing myself out there being as vulnerable as possible talking about subjects that most people don't enjoy talking about to make others feel a little bit more comfortable and normalised. I am one half of Come Curious, which is our little multimedia platform. Come Curious is something that Florence and I started on YouTube. And now it's grown to a podcast and social media. And we do very much the same thing, where it's sex education, body honesty, and mental health. So kind of all married the two together and I'm also a very proud sex worker. So I've got many fingers in many pies.

Jennie Williams: 3:26

You have, you have got all the fingers in all the pies and the toes, or whatever people like.

Reed Amber: 3:30

Oh yeah most of my followers love my feet. They really do. I have two only fans for this very reason, my normal Onlyfans or my OG account. And then my foot specific Onlyfan. It's just because the amount of requests I get to see my feet and I'm like, Hey, man, Whatever gets you off. I love it. Like I'm into feet myself. I'm down for it. And that is what I enjoy doing, is making people who have kinks and fetishes and feel shame around sex, feel comfortable. And like it's cool, because I think foot fetish is cool.

Jennie Williams: 4:03

It's funny, isn't it? I know, I've seen lots of people ask, and look at your feet. And we're gonna get into like the Fetish and the kink side in a minute because that's really interesting. But I think one of the biggest things for me, I mentioned when we started talking, you know, my default was I'm 42 and my boobs are a bit saggy. And they've fed a couple of kids and especially women go into this default of excusing ourselves a little bit don't we. That's what we do, when somebody goes nice dress or we go thank you, it was in this sale. You know? You can't just go Yeah, thanks. It looks looks wicked. That's why I wear it. I'm rocking it. You always have to make some kind of excuse and especially when it comes to sex we kind of have to like really play it down. But I mean, you're 30, this is still quite a young age, so when did you start having the confidence to be able to talk so openly about this.

Reed Amber: 4:58

I was really lucky growing up. My mum, she was very open about a lot of stuff. Especially now she's had a recent diagnosis of Asperger's so it might explain a hell of a lot of why we don't have much shame as a family. And there was not much shame growing up around talking about sex and nudity. But that was also sort of programmed into us in that you can always talk about anything with anyone. And my sister and I are exactly the same, there isn't really any limits with what we talk about. And I think a lot people get confused, because we're family, and yet we're talking about quite explicit sex stuff. And I do the same with my mum. And I have done with my dad and with my brother. Of course, the gender split kind of makes that little bit more complicated. But that's something that we're trying to bridge the gap on, because there shouldn't be a divide when it comes to sex. And so through school, it was just sex was something that I was always interested in, that I was always happy to talk about, that I always wanted to learn more about. And when you have your group of friends, I was the sex one, the one that always came out with the ridiculous statements, the one that oh you're gonna lose your virginity first. Like I actually didn't. But sex was where I felt comfortable and where I felt like I prospered. And, I kind of had to relearn how to behave, and how to think growing up and going into the real world of office jobs and, you know, boyfriend's parents and realising that I just couldn't talk about the things that I wanted to talk about in that kind of environment. The amount of times that I've been in an office space, and I've had to have the meeting of you can't talk about that stuff here and I've really had to relearn that. But it's always just been something that I'm so comfortable with and being an exhibitionist, like myself, I've been putting up nudes on the internet of myself since I was like 17 because Tumblr, rip Tumblr, but that was like a real waking moment for me. And just just playing to what I enjoy, and to what makes me feel good, regardless of what society feels. And then putting myself on social media. And it's almost like a really explicit form of therapy, is putting out something that is so personal and so vulnerable, and something that makes you feel terrified to talk about. This year, I finally came out on my stories as a tickle fetishist, which is something I've kept hidden and secret since I can remember, like nine years old or something. And just doing little things like that, coming out in public and owning the things that make me feel embarrassed or make me feel shame, has really helped me to see how important it is to talk about that. The thing that I feel most embarrassed or shameful about is the thing that needs to be addressed. And needs to be put out there because that's the thing that's holding me back from being myself. So being able to do that on my Instagram, I feel very lucky and I feel very privileged to do so. And I can safely say that this year being 30 years old, I finally feel like me, like my full, ultimate self that I don't have to hide any part of me and it's so liberating. And I would recommend it for everyone.

Audio recording: 8:21

Yeah, that's such a liberation, isn't it? I can really relate to a lot of what you said. At school, I was always the person that talked about sex, I was giving cock classes on the Calippo. You know, that was me. But I think that the difference between us is where you have kind of gone, this is me, warts and all, very publicly. Whereas I guess the way that I went down was setting Enhance up, and saying everybody has the right to be able to talk about sex, everybody has the right to be able to be sexual and we've done it through the charity. But there's still element that I keep back of myself because that scares the shit out of me, you know I'll be honest with you, doing what you're doing, even though I think I'm pushing the same messages in the same way, I'm not exposing myself personally, not in the way that you are. And that's a really brave thing to do and you see so many younger people doing that now when I can sit back and go, Wow, you know, that's a ballsy move, isn't it? It's a lifestyle.

Damian Weatherald: 9:27

It is. I was the other way, I was the shy one at school and obviously now that's all I talk about is sex, every day. But it's definitely a brave thing. Is there any negative to it though, Reed?

Reed Amber: 9:41

Oh, yeah, there are tonnes of negatives especially now where it's almost like vulnerability is currency, where you're not necessarily getting the engagement that you want, if you're not open and pouring your life story out online at the moment. And so you have people that might not feel comforted while doing it, who feel inadequate or compare themselves to others who might, thinking I'm never going to be able to talk like that, or those who maybe have done a post talking about some kind of issue which could be anything from drug addiction or something personal to them, or a mental health issue that they've gone through, realise that they've had loads of likes on it, and then have that almost pull and feel like they need to put more out there to get that engagement back. And that can be really tricky. I'm currently in that state at the moment where I put out a post recently, which blew up, went crazy, it was all about shaving rash and it was quite an explicit image, it was half of my my venus mound, if you will, with pubes, shaving rash, like spots all over it, where I was really uncomfortable, I was upset about it as well. And that got picked up by the Instagram algorithm and skyrocketed and it ended up having something like 240,000 likes, and my Instagram is a moderate size, but I've never had anything like that before. I mean, my posts, my engagements get around the 4000 mark maybe up to eight or 9000 likes, at the moment, I currently have just over 100,000 followers on my account, which is incredible. And I never thought I would get here either. But that one post, the shaving post did give me something mad, like 20,000 followers in two weeks' time. And I mean, that blows my mind, especially when, as you know, Instagram really doesn't like sex content. It really pushes that away, we know that there are particular keywords that are blacklisted on purpose for it, so I honestly never thought that my stuff would be picked up. But it just goes to show the need and the want for content like that, how important it is for people to see. I'm not harming anyone. What I put out there wasn't gross or shameful and yet so many people related to it and thought, oh my god, I can still be sexy and deal shaving rash. It doesn't make anyone feel nice.

Damian Weatherald: 12:10

Yeah. The one you put out, I think was it a couple of weeks ago, the one with the tampon string on show.

Reed Amber: 12:16

Yeah, tampon string, baby.

Damian Weatherald: 12:20

I thought it was brilliant. And it blew up because people were sharing it and talking about it. But I love the honesty that's on your account, especially in really dark subjects you'll talk about like drugs, your anxiety. That can't easy. I saw your posts the other week, you were sat outside a church talking about drug use and things.

Reed Amber: 12:43

Yeah, my drug addiction. Yeah.

Damian Weatherald: 12:45

That was really deep. But I think that could help so many people in that similar situation.

Reed Amber: 12:50

Thank you. I mean that's also something that I've been wanting to talk about for ages, but not knowing how to talk about it. Because I'm not an expert. I'm not a sexpert. I'm just somebody who talks about what they've learned and talks about their opinions and thoughts openly. And that can be dangerous as well, because people might take what I say as gospel and that's dangerous, too. I have to be careful about what I say. But with the drug addiction stuff, this year is the first year I've looked back and gone oh my god, I've been addicted to drugs for 10 years and, of course, I didn't want to see it, then because drugs are great and that's all I relied myself on, especially when you're dealing with mental health issues, and your escapism is drink and drugs. And so now I've come to a comfortable place where I can look back and go oh my god, that was me then, and yes, it does feel uncomfortable to talk about because how do I talk about drug addiction? I'm still not even 100% out of the clear of it. I'm still trying to figure out how I want to live my life and what works for me. Do I want to find a balance? Or do I want to stop completely? And I don't want to give people the wrong impression of like, drugs are great, Yay, everyone should do them because that's also dangerous and irresponsible. But all I can do is really talk about my experience and drugs were really fun for me then. But they were also covering up a much larger problem. And what I want to put out there mainly about doing content around drug addiction is that drug addiction isn't what you imagine it to be, but for so long, I didn't think that I was a drug addict because I assumed drug addict looked like what we saw in the movies, you know, junkies, squatters, sorry to use all these horrible words, but that living hand to mouth. And I was like, that's not me, you know, I'm not like that I work really well when I'm on drugs and I would use that as an excuse, I would get a bag of coke in and sit there and do loads of work on the laptop for hours and hours and excuse it. And that's a high functioning drug addict and I'm sure any one of us knows somebody who's addicted to painkillers, who drinks too much alcohol, who works too much, we all have our vices, and we will have our addictions and no one ever thinks, hey, that's me, I've got the problem. So hopefully in coming out about it, maybe it will help somebody else realise that they need to cut down or rethink the way they do about something that they do a lot.

Jennie Williams: 15:14

I think that's the thing, isn't it, now with people like you talking really openly, obviously, a lot of the people that listen to this have got various different impairments. And I think a lot of the time people aren't always looking for answers, they're looking for somebody to relate to, to kind of go, yes, you get me. That's exactly how I'm feeling, or that's what I've been going through. They don't necessarily want to be preached to and be told that something's right or wrong. I certainly know when I went through IVF and I was just looking for people to have the relatability, and I think that's the thing with lots of people. And you talk about anxiety and I also think you've talked about having IBS before.

Reed Amber: 15:57

Yes, IBS. Oh, that motherfucker. It's like my best friend and worst enemy. I've been suffering with IBS since I was a child, I would have stomach issues constantly. I'm realising a lot of it is anxiety related, not just IBS. IBS is such a fuck as well, because you feel like you go to the doctor for any kind of stomach issues and they're like, that's IBS. But IBS really means you've got stomach issues and I don't know what the fuck they are. So I'm just going to dob you with IBS and you just have to suffer with that. I feel for anyone dealing with IBS or stomach issues at the moment.

Jennie Williams: 16:37

I'm exactly the same actually, I went years ago, I think I was 12, 13 IBS, there we go, here's an umbrella to put over. But it's so horrible because let's face it, when you're trying to get it on, and you've got IBS, it's not the one is it. It does not make it easy.

Reed Amber: 16:54

No, all I want to do is just go and have a shit in peace and I can't do that. I'm either constipated or I've got the runs. And I'm terrified about what I want to eat, there was a good couple of years, where I was so scared to go outside for dinner, because I was scared I was going to have an IBS flare up and be caught short and shit myself. And that has happened before. Especially again with the waves of anxiety and it would turn into panic for me and panic attacks and anxiety and so I would end up avoiding eating out anytime. I would just have to bring a cereal bar if we were going to go out for drinks. That's not good. That's not fun. I want to be able to enjoy myself. So yeah, owning it online really helped me overcome a lot of that. And comedy and laughter and taking the piss out of it also really helped. I'm not saying it's like a good thing to do and it cures. But it's also a really great way to normalise something that makes it horrible for you. Because if you're having a laugh about it, and it's the same with anything, you know, sex, you just have to be careful not to laugh too much where you're overshadowing the actual issue, and you're actually still working hard at working on it and working on your mental health. It's okay to have a laugh, because some people might feel awkward. A lot of people do not like talking about shit. It's like, well, if you're my friend, you're going to have to be okay with it because that's what I'm going to be doing half the time, is shitting. Or at least thinking about it.

Jennie Williams: 18:21

One of my neighbours had a new new girlfriend and they were talking about moving in and I said, Well, yeah, brilliant, you can move in, they've got a three bedroom house, and she said, but I really think we should move, they'd only been together three months, I think we should move to somewhere else because what if I need to go for a poo, and she whispered this and you know ehen you're like, Oh my god, I think you're going to see each other poo or be around that, you both need to go to the toilet. And I think this is the thing you know, we've tried to present this perfect thing and going back to what you said about the shaving rash and like needing to go, doing a fart and all of that, I mean yeah, okay I mean, it's not always the most attractive, but we're humans and our bodies don't always act the way that we want them to act, it doesn't mean that we're not sexy. You know, it's really important, if you don't have that control, and lots of people who are going to be listening, might have stomas, various different things, colitis or Crohn's or whatever. And it's okay to know that these things can happen and we can still feel sexy. So important.

Damian Weatherald: 19:30

Yeah, and it's that whole thing of it can go wrong during sex as well. I'll talk about how I've dislocated my shoulders, my hips having sex and things like that. You've got to see that funny side to it sometimes. It might not be funny, but it is, and you've got to try and just go through the movement, for that want of a word when that happened.

Jennie Williams: 19:53

Damian, you did dislocate a rib going for a poo?

Reed Amber: 19:58

Stop it.That must have been an extreme poo. What

Damian Weatherald: 20:00

No it was just a normal poo and a rib came happened? out.

Reed Amber: 20:05

No! Oh my god, was it a laughing moment? Or was it agony? Were you like, what the fuck?

Damian Weatherald: 20:12

No it was a laughing moment.

Reed Amber: 20:16

Was it a poo though or were you trying to suck yourself off? And you're like, No, no, it was a poo I swear.

Jennie Williams: 20:23

Now every time you come on to a meeting and you say you dislocated a rib, I'll be like or do you think you're Prince?

Reed Amber: 20:30

I mean, we've all been there. I just haven't dislocate them yet. But I'm still trying.

Jennie Williams: 20:35

That's why I go to Pilates three times a week, you know?

Reed Amber: 20:37

Hey, Oh, nice.I mean a lot of what we're embarrassed about is society, is other people. All the things that we're scared about talking about is because somebody else at some point in our lives has made it seem like it's not okay. Really, what we feel comfortable with, like think about how you would feel if you were on your own, like naked, masturbating, everything, farting, shitting, pissing, vomiting, everything like that. And it's as soon as other people come into the mix, they make you feel uncomfortable about it. The stuff that you want to talk about, if you're holding yourself back, the stuff that you want to do, if you're holding yourself back, ask where that's come from, because more likely it's not come from you, it's come from parents, partners, friends they've had the problem with it and put their thoughts and opinions on you. And I mean, we can't help that, that is part of being human. That is part of society. Even now, I'm going through a moment with my boyfriend where he's not really cool with farting, but like farting is something that is like fundamental to me. So we're trying to go through the ways of, okay, well, I just feel uncomfortable a lot of the time. Cool, right? Where's the compromise? How are we going to figure this out? And I'm not stopping the conversation. We will keep conversating about it until we find a happy medium.

Jennie Williams: 22:01

Just fart a tune or something, where you train yourself.

Reed Amber: 22:05

That'd be great. Everyday is fart Happy Birthday.

Jennie Williams: 22:08

yeah, or he can he can put a playlist and then you can just practice it. I know that we've got so much talk to you about but you talked a lot about fetishes and kinks, so can you just tell people, what's the difference between a fetish and a kink?

Reed Amber: 22:30

So, and it's taken me all my life to figure this out, even someone with a couple of fetishes and loads of kinks. So a kink, generally speaking is something that doesn't turn most people on. You can go through phases in and out you can see something on porn or do something with your partner and you're like, I really fancy that, that's quite nice. That feels good, I'm into it. But it's something that maybe you could take or leave, it's not fundamental. But a fetish is something that is fundamental to your pleasure. It's something generally speaking that has come about since adolescence, childhood through an experience that has almost like hard coded itself into your brain into your sex psyche. And a lot of the time a fetish is something that's non sexual or non sexual act, body part, or item. So for example, latex could be a fetish, denim could be a fetish. boots could be a fetish. For me, tickling is a huge fetish. Bondage is a fetish being tied up. Of course, there's a lot of crossover as well, that you can have a lot of kinks that are fetishes, a lot of fetishes that are kinks but the main difference is a fetish is the thing that you almost can't escape from. That's the thing that's always there that you always go back to that you always think about. Even if you repress it for years, it will always come up. And that's taken me so long to figure out even though I have fetishes myself. It was like a real penny drop moment when I figured that out. I was like, oh okay, because a lot of people use it as just a term. A lot of people think of fetish they think of BDSM, dungeon, bondage, sadomasochism, all that kind of stuff. But no, a fetish could be a door handle, and somebody has a fetish for door handles, and a lot of people feel a lot of shame. I feel like kinks are something that people can talk about, fetishes are something that people have had to try and hide and and learn to figure out and get around especially because a lot of the time it's an experience. When you're younger there's a lot of weird feeling involved around it. So I feel for anyone that has a fetish, because it's so tough trying to come to terms with it yourself, unless you're lucky and you have a partner that you can talk to but even I struggled talking to partners, to anyone about it. And it wasn't until last year that I was like, Okay, I need to fucking own this because I just feel sad for little old me, somebody who has a tickling fetish that hasn't been able to explore it because I haven't allowed myself to.

Damian Weatherald: 25:15

Where would you stand on fetishes that affect other people because we get a lot of questions at Enhance about devoteeism, which for anyone is the fetish about someone being disabled. It puts a lot of people in awkward situations with dating and things like that because they're worried they might be just dating a devotee and they're not sure. So where would you give advice on that?

Reed Amber: 25:43

Yeah, of course, like fetishization can happen all the time. And I feel like fetishisation is something that somebody's going for you because of that thing, that one thing. So whether it is a disability, or an amputee, but it's so hard to say or think about because I'm also trying to put myself in the position of how I would see it if I knew someone else, like, you know everyone's got hands, everyone can tickle, that's not necessarily true but I know that I've also put myself there, well, if they can't do it properly, am I necessarily going to stay interested? Of course, I've debunked that. Most people don't understand that it is a fetish. Again, I didn't realise that I had a fetish, I thought it was just something that I was into, or something that everyone had, that they just didn't talk about. It just means that they don't understand it themselves, that there's a lot of shame involved, that it just needs to be talked about. I'm sure there are questions, and things that you can do to try and figure out if it's a fetish, or if really they don't mind and a lot of the time sometimes, if it is a fetish, they might fall in love with your personality regardless. But of course you need to protect yourself and it is devastating to figure out that you have been fetishized and that was it, that you were just seen as a sexual object. And I get the same with sex work, a lot of people would just want to fuck me because I'm a sex worker, rather than love my personality or who I am. But that also takes time and figuring out where your self esteem is from. And regardless of whether you're fetishized or not, if this person is just going to fuck you and leave you or do something with you and leave you, how that would make you feel and how you pick yourself up and move on. Of course, it's more likely to happen if they have a fetish, but you can talk to them about it, you can ask them openly. What is it that you want out of this? Why did you want to meet with me today? Do you have a fetish for this? Is this something you're sexually into? If so, okay, let's talk about it, let's have a conversation. If they don't feel comfortable talking about it, then it's going to be hard no matter what. It's one of those you just have to own or try to own. But of course, it takes time and it so depends on who you're talking to as well because there's a lot of people out there that will get offended or aggressive or upset because you're asking these questions, but then they need more time to figure it out. And you need to step the fuck back.

Jennie Williams: 28:24

I don't know if you've seen it, there's a great documentary that the lovely Emily Yates, who's part of our team, made and it's called Meet the Deevotees. If anyone wants to watch it, and if you haven't seen it Reed it's well worth a watch. She really dives into the world of Devoteeism and goes out to America and speaks to lots of devotees. And it's just really interesting and just from from from Enhance's point of view, if anyone out there is listening, and you feel like this is something that's affecting your life, then please feel free to get in touch with us in the Love Lounge because we're always here to support you with that, it's a big thing. The next thing and I probably will have to be quick on this because I reckon this is about a three hour chat we could do because we're really interested because we have lots of people contact us about swingers clubs, sex clubs, anything to do with that. Just talking about accessibility really, and lots of people saying we want to go and it's shit, we can't go in. I think you visit quite a lot of clubs and go to places, don't you?

Reed Amber: 29:27

Yes, well, I'm privileged, I don't have a visible disability or something that might prevent me from going to a place like this unless it was anxiety, or my obsessive compulsive disorder has stopped me from going out and leaving the flat but luckily my escapism is is going to places like this. So I can't talk necessarily from a point of view where you might need to have actual physical access. There's a lot of sex parties going on. There's a lot of good ones that are happening. It's not just about elitism, I know that there are some places that are quite elitist, you know, like photo verification and all this stuff. But there are some really good communities that you can find. I wish I could remember them off the top of my head.

Jennie Williams: 30:23

Do you know what maybe if you can, and you send them over to us and then we can put the information out for people, because we're doing quite a big project on this. And we're on a mission aren't we Damien to really find as many, or if any of you guys who are listening, know nany sex clubs, any swingers clubs, any fetish clubs, that are accessible and physical access is obviously one of the big things but maybe if people have made reasonable adjustments and being able to let somebody use a room upstairs, you know if there's a dungeon or something and you can't get downstairs, things like that we'd be really interested to know about because everyone has a right to do this, and to be able to explore, and it's just one side of things that is just so unaccessible frankly. If there any millionaires out there listening we need an amazing dungeon with a lift put in. That's what we need.

Reed Amber: 31:22

Oh, beautiful, that'd be the dream. Yeah, I know it's hard anywhere. Alot of people that I know, do run sex parties, fetish parties, but even they really struggle finding the venues that allow that, I don't wanna say behaviours, like we're back at school, but allow that kind of fun, and the nudity, and the online rep that they might get. So I think it's not as easy. I mean you're looking for a place for a sex party, there's not many venues out there that are going to be okay with that. And so the pocket is even smaller for people who need accessibility. But you're right, we need to strive and push forward to find that and make it more inclusive. But inclusivity is so good at the moment, it's getting better. Even just listening to my friends who work in normal offices and they're creating inclusion and diversity teams, and talking more about mental health and women's struggles and violence, and so many good things are happening. But we just need to make sure that we're also putting that in place, wherever we are. Not necessarily putting ourselves out there if we don't feel comfortable or safe to but talking to our bosses and saying, Hey, is it okay if I put a group together that does talk about inclusivity? And we meet up every week? Can we put some funding behind it? Can we push for this? Can we push for this change? Of course, it's hard work doing so but the more that we do that the more normalised it will be, and soon we'll live in a world where it will be weird if it's not inclusive. It'll be like, Oh, that's what, okay, I'm not working there anymore, no.

Damian Weatherald: 33:02

That is the ideal.

Reed Amber: 33:03

Yeah it's the dream.

Jennie Williams: 33:05

I mean, it's like any charity, I think you set a charity up, and your long term goal is to not have to exist anymore. And that's what I would really like, is that we don't have to exist anymore, but at the moment we do and I know that there is going to be so many people listening to this and listening to you, and we're not expecting everyone to suddenly like start taking their clothes off and putting their photos up or doing any of that but, just for people to know, you are sexy, you are amazing, you are beautiful, you are handsome. There is always going to be people out there that find you attractive, and I know that the people that listen to this, need that and need people like you trailblazing, so for all the negative stuff that I know that you get that you mentioned, there's so much positive, and Damian and I are massive fans of yours, we really are. And I think it's very brave to be able to do that and I just want our listeners to know that we're here to support you, if you need to be able to feel that liberation, just like Reed does. But before we go, is there anything else you want to kind of add and tell us about or promote anything that you're up to that you want us to know about?

Reed Amber: 34:30

Yeah, I mean, there's loads of stuff, it's all exciting. But I did want to say, if you are finding yourself lost in your community, you can do little things like making sure that you are following the people that inspire you and empower you and unfollowing the people or muting the people that make you feel negative and down about yourself. And that's really hard to do because we are so invested in social media, putting that out there making sure that you're watching the right programmes and putting the support there and it's the same with the devotees. I wanted to add that they are also human too, they are people. And a lot of the time, it's a lack of understanding from their side, it's a lack of education of them not understanding how to talk about things or communicate. So as much as they might offend you, you could also offend them and upset them. And so they don't know how to move forward from it. If somebody does something that upsets you or offends you, it takes a lot of gall to not be angry not to react on an emotional level, and to sit there and ask questions and find out why they've said or done the things that they might have done. Of course, it's not your place to educate them, you can tell them to fuck right off but I've always found that asking people why they feel that way, if somebody feels negative towards my sex work, I'm in there with asking what makes you think that? where has that thought process come from? Who has taught you that information? and to try and hit the nail on the head and most of the time if you are calm and collected, they will listen and it will help them see a different side of things, maybe not immediately, but hopefully plant that seed. So yeah, my stuff which is mainly just me on Instagram, that's probably my biggest port of call. I have some exciting things coming up, but I can't necessarily share them unfortunately, not just yet anyway. And of course, please check out Come Curious, and that's on YouTube, and we have the podcast fucks given but fuck is spelled F Asterix asterix K s given.

Damian Weatherald: 36:40

Which is absolutely brilliant.

Reed Amber: 36:42

Ah, thank you. And also stop apologising for things, like Jennie, exactly how you said, if somebody complements you just take that compliment. And the more we push to do things like that, the more it brain trains us to react that way. So thank you, thank you for my compliments, and we deserve them.

Jennie Williams: 37:04

Reed thank you so so much for coming on, and taking the time to chat to us, we really appreciate it. And I know that everyone will really get a lot from listening to you. And if we can share any of your stuff, the exciting projects once they come out or whatever, then send stuff our way and we will absolutely do that.

Reed Amber: 37:23

Amazing. Thank you. I love the support, the community, it's just so warming. It's not about being against each other and trying to outdo each other or be better because that's what Instagrams forced us to think, this weird idea of inadequacy and also that followers and likes means how good of a person you are, how popular you are or how much money you gain. It's not about that. It's about being happy within yourself, enjoying what you do, being the person that you want to be regardless of what other people think. It will be a long and arduous journey, but you'll never look back and regret. You'll only end up just loving it even more. Thank you so much for having me on. It's been so amazing.

Damian Weatherald: 38:04

Thank you so much and exactly, the more open conversations we have like this, the better society will be. End of.

Reed Amber: 38:13

Love it, let's strive for a better future.

Audio recording: 38:16

Thank you so much for listening. If you'd like any more information about the work we do under the Undressing Disability campaign, then go on to our website at enhancetheuk.org and click on the Undressing Disability tab.