Asta Philpot

Hosts Jennie and Zoe chat to TV personality and pundit Asta Philpot.  Asta was born with Arthrogryposis, a condition called that impairs physical movement. 

They about his first sexual experience, care homes, and how he found his true love. 

Follow Asta on instagram @astaphilpot or visit www.astaphilpot.com

Contains explicit content 

Transcript

JENNIE: Hello and welcome to series three of the Undressing Disability Podcast, where we talk all things sex and disability. With me, one of your host, Jennie Williams, and my lovely co host, Zoe Lloyd. We have so many exciting guests on this series, and we really hope you enjoy it just as much as we do.

MUSIC 

On this episode, Zoe and I chat to TV personality and pundit Asta Philpot. Asta was born with a condition that impairs physical movement. We chat about his first sexual experience, care homes, and how he found his true love. We hope this episode inspires you as much as it inspired us. 

JENNIE: Hello and welcome. Oh, we have the lovely Asta Philpot on our podcast. Hello, Asta. 

ASTA: Hi. Nice to be here. 

JENNIE: Is it, though? Because I've been trying to hunt you down and chase you down for quite a few weeks, and I've finally, finally got you on. 

ASTA: Yeah, I kind of felt like I've been on an episode of The Hunted, but, yeah, I am here, and it's good to be here.

JENNIE: You know, just flatter me and make me feel really good that I've worn you down to actually be on our podcast. I think, you know what Asta ,what we’d quite like to do is kind of go back in time a little bit and go right back to childhood. 

But actually, before that, would you mind just telling people, the listeners, just a little bit about yourself? If you're happy to describe to people what your disability is and how it affects you, that would be really helpful. 

ASTA: Yeah, sure. I have Arthrogryposis, and it's a disability where it affects the muscles and joints. So basically, when I was born, I couldn't walk, I couldn't breathe for myself, and I can't use my hands, so I use an electric wheelchair, and I need full time care. 

JENNIE: I think it's always interesting to say, isn't it, because a lot of the time, people say they're disabilities, and most people go, what the hell is that? I've never heard of that before. So it's like we always say, it's just about how it affects someone's access, really, It’s kind of like that's the interesting bit, isn't it? 

We're going to talk about sex and disability. That's what this podcast is about. But if we can take you kind of right back, as I said, to childhood, at what point do you remember kind of thinking about sex? Thinking about, probably wasn't even sex. Maybe it was masturbating, I don't know. And thinking actually, my body is working differently to my peers and people around me. 

ASTA: It was probably from the age of when I went to college. Because when I was young, I went to a school for people with disabilities, and so I never really saw any kind of differences that popped out that made me think that, think oh, wow, I'm different, and other people are doing things differently to me in terms of relationships and sexually.

But when got to college, I studied performing arts, and I was the only person who was disabled on the course. And obviously at college, you do the things that students do. You go out at night, you meet people, you date, whatever. But I started to think that, wow, this is working really differently for me, and I'm being looked at really differently, which was er..scary. And almost, I kind of found that I took it on as a challenge.

I think the college is when it really popped out for me. 

ZOE: Did that affect your confidence? I'm guessing that would lessen your confidence, having gone into that environment and then being treated differently. 

ASTA: Yeah, although I was kind of from a very young age, I was a confident person anyway. Yeah. That really knocked me back. And I started to think, I'm never going to have a relationship without…um naturally. It's never going to happen naturally.

It certainly did, and I think people started to see that, especially my parents, who I'm really close with and was close with then as well. 

ZOE: Oh, that's good. So you had that support from them, because I was thinking, oh, would you disclose that to your peers at school or college? Would you also be like, God, guys, this has been difficult for me, or did they sense that? 

ASTA: Yeah, I did. I was open with everyone, really, and especially Mum and Dad. People talk and say, oh, I can never talk about this with Mum an my Dad, and there's a part of me that understands it, but then there's a part of me, for me especially, that I've grown up with my Mum and Dad all my life.

They've given up essentially their lives to look after me. Why on earth wouldn't I be able to have an open conversation with my Mum and Dad about this subject when in actual fact, they're my friends? 

JENNIE: It’s really interesting, isn't it? Because when I asked the question, you kind of skipped to college, and that surprised me because that's a massive chunk of your life that you've kind of missed out. And most people don't go from like, oh, college is the first time I'm actually thinking about fancying people or masturbating or even sex.

But what happened before that? What about at school? Did you have partners? Were you talking about sex within your peers, because college isn't until you're about 17/18. 

ASTA: Yeah, school was very much for me adapting to my disability and getting my disability right, because I've got Scoliosis as well as Arthrograposis. So part of that was I did a lot of hydrotherapy. I had a lot of physio. It was all contained in the school I went to, so it didn't really occur to me these feelings didn't really come to the forefront of my mind at that point. 

Although I will say, when I did hydrotherapy, I was starting to think that the physios were really hot. Was a little bit awkward!

ZOE: In your skinny speedos? 

ASTA: I don't know. Yeah. Never worn speedos.

Good. That's good for the nation!

LAUGHTER

JENNIE: What about sex education at school? Did you have sex education? Was it spoken about? 

ASTA: Do you know what? No, it wasn't. And that's a really good question. And it wasn't emphasised in the school I went to. And now, when I look back, I think, was that because I went to a school with disability and the whole kind of thought around disability and the preconception is, oh, people with disabilities don't have these feelings.

So I don't know whether it was that, but no, I can't ever remember having a sex education class. The only thing I could remember is hating RE. So, no, it just didn't come in. 

ZOE: It’s really weird, though, isn't it? Because there must have been other pupils there that were demonstrating sexual behaviours. So even though you said, oh, I wasn't really aware of it. I wasn't thinking like that. There must have been people. So why weren't the caregivers thinking, hang on a minute, how are we going to deal with this just to do a blanket ‘we're not going to talk about sex education’ and relationship education and leave you naive until you hit college years. It's just madness, isn't it? 

ASTA: No, I totally understand that, but then I've talked to Jennie about this before that I've actually stayed in a residential care home. And in a way, it's the same premise, isn't know, you go to a school for people with disabilities and the caregivers don't think about the subject. You go into a residential care home when I was 30. In my late 30s caregivers don't think of this. So it's on par to me, so I'm not really surprised. 

ZOE: And this is where the massive hole is, isn't it? People are in care homes, and that's the whole point of Jennie starting up in Enhance the UK. Nobody's having those discussions around. And I think it's amazing that you said you're so close to your parents and they're your best friends, Unfortunately, a lot of people that are disabled, maybe their parents infantilise them and they dare go there, but like you say, they're doing all the intimate stuff. You're relating on a different level to other people might do with their parents, but still they won't bring up that subject. It's like, oh, gosh, do I even want to say that to my son?

ASTA: I think they do infantilise them, but I also think it's this kind of bubble wrap protection force field that parents or caregivers have around people who are disabled. To me, yes, it comes from a very loving place, but in my experience, my parents were not like that, and in my experience, that can destroy someone's confidence and how they live the rest of their lives.

Because do we live introverted and we don't go out and we fear going out and fear people seeing us? Or do we actually celebrate us and celebrate what we can do and how we look? And I'd rather take the latter stance. 

ZOE: Yeah, absolutely. You take the shot, don't you, really? And then you might find the person, which we'll obviously come on to later. And with the Love Lounge, we get so many people writing into us, often younger men maybe living with their parents. Some are happy and talk to their parents about everything. They've been included, perhaps, on our chats with the family, which is fantastic, but others are saying, Look, I've got to email you, I can't chat to you, I can't talk to my family about it. And you're thinking, My God, you are literally trapped. Because they are completely dependent on their parents. They can't have that conversation and they're effectively stuck in their room, only with a computer. And it's just soul destroying, really, because it leaves us with fewer options about how they can get out there and go and, like you say, go down the street, embrace it, because then someone will be attracted to you and how you present yourself. But if you're stuck in your bedroom, where do you go?

ASTA: It is sad and it's incredibly demoralising. And I've had first hand experience because my best friend had muscular dystrophy and we always used to talk about sex and relationships and stuff, and one day he came to me and said, I think I want an escort. But I can’t tell my Mum. And to me my heart just sunk and instantly I wanted to help him. But unfortunately he passed away without ever having that experience. And I know we'll get onto this, but from that moment is when my journey started of wanting to help other people get the experience they want. 

ZOE: Yeah. And hopefully you'll hear one of our previous podcasts with a guy called Ben Parkinson and he was very much like you, passionate about helping his friend who think he also had muscular dystrophy and wanted to have a sexual experience and they managed to facilitate that.

So yeah, those two stories link and it's so prevalent, it is mostly what people write about into us at the Love Lounge.

ASTA: I get emails every day, I got one on Instagram this morning from someone in the same position, you know. So it's always there, it's not going to go away. And I think it's incredible what people like Jennie are doing and you and Love Lounge and Enhance. I just think it's so enlightening and motivating and hopeful because people need hope in this world and if we can't look outside of ourselves and find hope, then what's the point?

JENNIE: Absolutely. So you went through school and then you went to college, you said this kind of struggles with that and then at any point through college did you have a relationship? Were you intimate with anybody? What did that look like for you? 

ASTA: No, not in college. No. It didn't happen as much as I wanted it to happen. And the longing was there and my heart was just absolutely I know you don't like this kind of stuff because cringy Jennie but my heart was bursting for someone even at that point. I was like 18/19. I wanted someone who I could spend the rest of my life with and share with. But all I saw was this…I always give the analogy of soldiers are on the battlefield and they're in the trenches and they see ahead of them what's to come and the fight they've got on their hands. And that's exactly how I saw it at that point because it was just so daunting. So I think the first…I went through college and after college I got an apprenticeship at ITV and that's when I first had a relationship when I started going out with my colleagues and maybe a bit more mature and older, I don't know, but something just seemed to click and I had the confidence, but that was probably down to the documentary I did. 

JENNIE: You started at ITV and you were doing that. And then I know at some point, because we're going on to the documentary, that you decided yourself that and I don't really want to make this whole kind of podcast about sex work, but I know that it's a big part of your story, that you wanted to use a sex worker.

Was that your first sexual experience? Because you kind of inverted commas wanted to get out of the way and explore that. 

ASTA: Yeah. So I went on holiday with my parents to Spain and we found this place called The Eclipse. And, at first I was really gung ho, I really wanted to go for it. So we went and I went into this place and I've never had so much attention in all my life, from female females. And to me, even before I'd had a sexual experience, something inside of me just thought, wow, I can do this. When you have a disability, you almost have this kind of preconception of like in your own mind that you're not attractive. And it almost needs someone to say and it's not from an ego point of view, it's someone to say to you, yeah, you're good looking or you're attractive or you're handsome. And I don't want it to sound big headed, but it's like that when you have a disability, you will almost need confirmation to give you the confidence to step into that next level. 

So I lost my virginity in a Spanish brothel and it was really difficult because she couldn't speak English, so telling her to take my belt off was just like another level.

ZOE: I’m thinking of the gestures here. 

ASTA: Yeah, I can't even gesture, so it's just like, I can remember belt, belt, seatbelt, restraint. It just wasn't happening. But anyway, it happened. And after, after we had sex, I just felt like a brand new human being. I felt like. I'd been reborn into a new body that I was happy with and from a young age, I was confident and I loved life, but from this point, I started to love myself. 

It was just such a shift, and I think it was from when I went to college, seeing all these able bodied people and all my friends getting into relationships and doing it so confidently. I think the reason why it was such a shift was because, yes, I went and paid for it and they're there to do a service or whatever, but within me, I felt confident again and I felt renewed. 

ZOE: Like you say, it's that validation, isn't it? And it's like, wow, someone wanted me. And also, I believe there's such a stigma about the B word. I think some people hold onto it like a label of, like, yeah, no, I'm going to wait, I'm going to choose, and they're proud of it.

But if you feel like you've been denied sex because of maybe a disability or the way you feel about yourself, to suddenly get rid of that label is enormous, like, such a weight off your shoulder. And I think that's that sense of renewed, like, hurrah, I don't have this big weight on me.

That's me. I'm you now. And now I'll take steps forward. 

ASTA: Absolutely. Society puts so many pressures on us as a human race, whether it's and we do it to each other, whether it's body image, body confidence, the virgin. Oh, haven't you lost your virgin yet? No.

From that moment, I just felt my shoulders felt a lot lighter. 

JENNIE: Lots of people write into us and they say it wasn’t…I first handed had that experience, I’ve supported somebody using a sex worker and actually they felt quite sad about it afterwards. It's like, okay, so does this mean every time I'm going to have to have pay for sex?

And they felt quite.. you felt, like, elated. And I know the person, they almost had this associated shame feeling. Obviously, everyone's going to feel different, aren't they? But how did you feel about moving on from that? Were you like, okay, I'm going to use more sex workers after this, or, now, this is a stepping stone, I need to be in a relationship.

ASTA: Do you know what? The confidence came and the moment of almost celebration and then the feeling of emptiness really hit me, like, really bad, like, almost to the point where I was, I was depressed, and that's because, that feeling of validation, that feeling of that person giving me so much attention, went away and I've had to explain to people that email me, that want this experience, that there's a huge dividing line between wanting a sexual experience and wanting love. 

Yeah, but sometimes the lines get blurred and I think it happens a lot as well with disabled people and caregivers, because I know a lot of disabled people who have fallen in love with their caregivers. So it's that line, isn't it, that needs to be separated? But unfortunately, I got caught in the kind of sad feeling, but it was a bad feeling. But there was another part of me that it drove me forward to wanting to, wanting a relationship and chasing that dream and never giving up.

And people say to me, people said to me, oh, there's someone out there. And I got to the point can I swear? 

JENNIE: Yeah, of course. 

ASTA: I got to the point where someone said to me, the last person said to me, oh, don't give up because there's someone out there. And I got to the point where I actually said to them, do you know what? Just fuck off, because you don't know my predicament and you don't know my situation. But looking back on that, everyone was right.

ZOE: It’s really difficult, isn't it? Because obviously we talk to people that have become in a relationship as you have, and so you're like, it does come right. And all my fears that I had in my 20s, stuff has come right and unfortunately you have to be bloody patient and maybe go the long haul.

Other people can go and get a life change. Maybe in three months we go, oh, ten years, yeah, my life changed, but you have to stick it out. But the sad thing is there will be a lot of people listening that are in that moment of will it ever happen?

And sometimes it won't, depending on your lifestyle, like you are happy to get out there. It's not going to happen when you're just sitting in your room, is it? Really? 

ASTA: Exactly. 

ZOE: I know lots of people do create relationships like that online, that seems to be today. But just going back to the sex work thing, it's really weird because when you described it as that high, I was picturing it almost like a drug that you could keep going back, keep going back.

Oh, yeah, that's my affirmation. That makes me feel great. Oh, yeah, I'm loved and I guess some people would just continue with that, but again, we've spoken to lots of people that go, yeah, did it, lost the label, I've had the sexual experience, but now I want. I want more, I want the relationship.

And it is all about that, isn't it? It is the love, the relating. Sex is just a mechanical act and I really do feel I've been in a similar predicament of really fearing something and worrying about a label and all that sort of stuff. And people say it's only sex.

And like any experience, when people have done it, they can say, oh, it's only that. But when you have haven't done something, be it anything, it means so much to you, doesn't it? So I think, like taking that step and saying, yeah, I've done it. You relieve so much weight off your shoulder, but it's only when you've done it that you realise it's only such and such.

It's so easy, isn't it, when we're ahead of the game and you go, oh, yeah, cool, I've done it. Totally true. But it doesn't feel like that first. 

ASTA: Number one, your analogy is totally right. It is like a drug, because, I’m not a drug taker, but when I was young, I had this or that or whatever, but you take the high and then you experience the crash and it's exactly the same. Number two, I know you said it's only sex, but I love it, especially now I've met my partner and my future soulmate that, to bond in such a way. And it's not just about penetration, it's about connecting each other's bodies and skin to skin. It's just absolutely awesome. And I said to my partner, actually, the other day, I was like, I hope we never get too old to want to stop this experience, because it's just awesome and it gives you such to me, it's like taking the drug that lasts forever. 

ZOE: That’s brilliant. 

JENNIE: And I think that, again, what you said right at the beginning, it’s hope, isn't it? And it's giving that hope. And I just want to bring in the care home experience with you, Asta because I know that when you and I met, we kind of bonded over this a little bit, because, as you know, this is a big thing for me, people living in care settings.

And in fact, that hope being stripped away from people. They're not even having a sniff of hope. So can you just tell us a little bit about because you were living with your parents and then you went into a care home, didn't you? How did that happen? How long for? Can you just tell us a little bit about that? 

ASTA: Yeah, so basically, I wanted to experience independence and I was starting to think very much like the virginity thing and the sexual. Can I do this? So I decided to try live independently. And first of all, I found a flat in Leeds and found it accessible, got a hoist, did did all the things that I needed to do.

And then, social services obviously were involved in ,because I needed night time care and stuff like that and someone to come in and put me to bed. So I said to them one day, look, I need more care if I'm going to live independently. And I remember it at the time, he said, well, all we can offer you is four visits a day.

And I'm like, Right, okay, so how does it work then, if the carer leaves at say, 11:00am from my flat, oh, and half an hour later I need to use the toilet?

I've got to wait another two to 3 hours. So I said, that isn't going to work. And he said, well, we just can't do it. We can't give the funding for this. So I said, well, what's the alternative then? He says, well, residential care. And you see these cartoon animations where the character's jaw drops to the floor. That's exactly what my expression was. I didn't have any other choice. So I went into residential care. I found the place, they didn't I found the place, I did a load of research and on first impressions it was absolutely, yeah, this is great, love it. Had my own room, own bathroom, could come and go as I please. But as time went on, I started to realise the shackles that get put on you as a person who is disabled in residential care. And that's when it started to be highlighted to me the problems and the battles people who are disabled have.

And as far as having a relationship goes, you had to clear it with this, you had to clear it with the board of the charity, you had to do this, you had to do that. What, you want sex in your room? Nah, that's not allowed. Caregivers aren't allowed to help you caregivers ,if big inverted commas, if they do help you, they can't address you, they can't do anything. So it's like it's an absolute nightmare. For someone who because I had a lot of friends in there who don't have any choice or didn't have any choice to move on, but for someone who is in there, it's hell. It’s not human, but it could be. It could be. And that's the thing. 

And I had so many arguments with the managers and even the board of the charity who ran the care home. I was like I was blue arguing with them, but they just didn't shift. They're almost like drones. 

JENNIE: The drive that I had to set the charity up was watching your experience day in, day out and just seeing people being so massively dehumanised, thinking you're going in there for independence and seeing people's personalities frankly slip away. Their identity slip away. People living in single beds and being told they have to be in by a certain time and not having those rights, where in fact, the law is not even supporting those policies. And what's being said, and now we know that CQC isn't supporting that either, that actually these are kind of internalised laws within care homes and care settings, which is a big part of what we're trying to change. And I know that that's something that you kind of are really on a mission to try and change as well.

But how did you go from being in a care setting, really having a lot of your rights taken away from you, being in the place where you are, to essentially being part of a Hollywood blockbuster film? What was the journey? How did that happen?

ASTA: Well, after the BBC documentary, I did a BBC One Life that followed me and two other guys on a road trip to lose their virginity.

JENNIE: How did that even come about though, Asta? How did that happen? 

ASTA: Okay, so basically, on the way back from the holiday where I lost my virginity with Mum and Dad, I said to them in the car, because we drove everywhere, because flying is a nightmare for me, I said to them, how do we help other people in my situation?

And we were just thinking and thinking and thinking for hours. And I said, the only way we can do it is on TV. So I worked for ITV at that point and I went back to the newsroom where I worked and I had a word with the producer, who at the time was producing a regional TV documentary strand, which she was really interested in. She wanted to do it to follow me, just me, to Spain to reenact losing my virginity.

But she says, oh, we'll have to do it within 48 hours. I was like, well, that's not going to work. So it escalated into this massive project. We approached a local production company in Leeds and the BBC commissioned it into a One Life strand.

It was one of the last One Life, actually, that got commissioned after the One Life strand got decommissioned. But the crew followed us. It went out onto the BBC after the News At Ten, it blew up, it was amazing. Got so much reaction from it. I was on This Morning and it just started the talking point again. It started people talking about it. And ever since then, I've done numerous documentaries with ZDF and National Geographic, the same road trip, but just with me. So, in actual fact, I think I could hold the record for visiting so many brothels, but the message was a lot deeper than that for me. It was showing the world that people who are disabled do have these feelings. 

So anyway, it went out and I got an email from a Belgian production company saying, we'd like to remake this into a movie. So, to cut a long story short, it got made into a really successful Belgian film called Hasta La Vista.

And the producer said to me, we're going to try get it into Hollywood. So it got sold into Hollywood, and at the time, I was in the care home and I was on a real low because of the situation I was in, and I just hated it in there. And I got this news and I was like, oh, my God, this is amazing. So then Come As You Are was born from Hollywood, and, yeah, that's basically how it happened. Because they say sex sells, doesn't it? But sex and disability is a taboo, and I believe, unfortunately, it will remain a taboo because people just can't grasp the fact that disabled people have these feelings and are not numb everywhere. 

JENNIE: Did the care home of the people around you appreciate what was happening in your life and know?

ASTA: Well, I think the first time they kind of really grasped it was because at the time, when I was staying there, I had to fly out to Austin, Texas, to the south by Southwest Film Festival, where the movie was being premiered. And after the movie was premiered, we had a photo shoot, me and the cast and the director, with Amazon Prime, and I sent the picture back to the care home because I was really good friends with the activities person and she just splattered the picture all over the notice boards and stuff.

But even when I got back, there was like such a dark and negative kind of undertone. It's like from the staff, they're like, oh, did you have fun? Like, fuck me. Does anything ever evolve in your life? Are you actually conscious? At that point? I was just like, I want to go back home because I can't live like this. 

JENNIE: And it's really important to say I mean, it's so hard, isn't it? Because I've worked as a carer myself. And obviously really important to say there are lots of amazing carers out there, there's lots of amazing staff that are doing great, great work. But we always come back to, we’ve had this conversation, there's a lack of support, there's lack of training, there's lack of understanding.

You almost like you go in on minimum wage or condition to get people washed, dressed, beds. It's pretty much like you're in a churn, aren't you? And so people like the activities person, they're normally the people that are enthusiastic about those things because they don't have the other basics that they have to do. But I can completely imagine what it was like. 

ASTA: I think where it goes wrong is that carers, it's not seen as a profession. 

JENNIE: Absolutely. 

ASTA: And as much as I sympathise with doctors and nurses going on strike and this and that, carers where are carers in all this? It needs to be seen as a vocation. It needs to be seen as something that, because I was speaking to a junior doctor the other day and I said, what about carers? And he was talking about progression and stuff and how the disallowed progression? I was like, well, what do carers have? 

And essentially, I know you're like saving lives, but carers are actually responsible for people's lives every single day. And it's not just on a physical level, it's also on a mental level as well. Because you're not just a carer, you're a counsellor as well. And you're a provider, you’re a carer, you're a counsellor. Do you know what I mean? There's all these things kind of wrapped into one, but it's just like people don't see it. And I don't get it. I really don't. 

ZOE: They have to look at the holistic part of you, don't they? And like you said, the medical model is, right, we're going to fix this. You've come in for however long it may be into the hospital and we're going to get you better. The carer, as you said, is a counsellor, but, yeah, they need to find ways to enrich your whole life and you might have a champion in that care home that really does want to do that if they've had those chats with you.

But as you said, if the training isn't there and they don't know the sort of legalities around it, and their boss is saying, no, it's a safeguarding issue. No. And they're just getting a blanket, no. There is no power for them, is there? Where do you go? Even if you're passionate in your heart, you're like, we can't do it, we can't.

And that's so sad to disempower these carers that are actually having the big conversations with the clients and developing those relationships and actually finding out what they need and then they can't do anything with it. 

ASTA: My Mum and Dad have cared for me. I'm 41 now, and give or take the couple of years I wasn't with them. My Mum and Dad have cared for me for 41 years now, and although they say they do it because they love me, they haven't received a penny, they can't get carers allowance because apparently they earn too much state pension and then they wonder why there's such a hole in the system. That a lack of carers. It's like, duh.

ZOE: You’re saving the government, like, 50 to 75 grand a year exactly by your parents doing that. Yeah. It's just madness, isn't it? 

JENNIE: Just to kind of wrap it up on a really positive note, I know that basically you went on telly, you cried about being lonely and then you found yourself girlfriend. Do you want to tell us about that? Because our ongoing joke is that I'm going to go on telly, have a bit of a cry, and then I might find the husband and man of my dreams. 

ASTA: See, this is why you haven't found him! So basically, me and Charlotte met on Tinder, and this was after I went on Steph’s Packed Lunch and just talked about my story and talked about how I wanted love so much. And I didn't plan on crying live on Channel 4, but it's kind of like, I think the whole, because I've thought about it afterwards and the whole experience and the battles I've been through and the brothels, the this, the that, the wondering whether I'll have a relationship in the trenches, seeing the daunting picture. Will it ever happen for me? 

And I think that's why I actually broke down, because it was almost a release. So after being on there, it's funny how it happened, actually, I was on Tinder a couple of nights after and swipe left, swipe right, swipe right, and I swiped right. And anyway, Charlotte messaged me back and she says, oh, my God, I saw you on Steph's Packed lunch and we've just matched. So to me, that was a bit of magic.

And you I think in life, you've got to be a believer in magic. And it's not voodoo or spiritual, it's just the realisation that you can make anything happen. And you're right, you can't just sit in your room and you need to actually make the effort and get out there and do it. And that was what I did. I put myself out there and I said, hey, I'm going through this and I really need someone in my life. And it happened. And she's just the most amazing person I could have ever wished to meet. She's just beautiful and she's that kind of person where she says to me, you will never have to rely on care or go in a care home again as long as I am able to. 

So for me, that's just like the most unconditional love someone can experience. And that part of my life is, I feel like when you like, oh, gosh, it's great. And it gives me the empowerment now to help other people who are on that journey. When I started at 18 years old. 

JENNIE: That is really nice. Again, you talk about hope and you talk about magic, is there any parting words that you can give to other people that have been in your situation that may be in care homes listening to this, or almost going back to your younger self? Are there any last parting words that you can give?

ASTA: Just don't ever give up on who you really are. And that true feeling inside, because the true feeling inside of me when I was born and from a very young age was, I love myself. This is how it is and this is how I am. I'm going to make the best of it and I'm not going to give up. And then I have my down days and this and that, but when I wake up first thing in the morning, I'm always incredibly grateful to be alive. And if you can start from that premise, anything is possible.

ZOE: Yeah, it really is. And I think it is the light that shines within that attracts people. That may sound a bit airy fairy. 

ASTA: No, you're right. 

ZOE: No matter what we look like on the outside. Let's look at all the beautiful people that are desperately unhappy and they still have failed relationships.

It really isn't about the aesthetics. We think it is, and we're conditioned to think it is. But you've proved you're glowing. You've gone out there with confidence and you've attracted the person.

It's simple, really. 

ASTA: I talk about the Law of attraction a lot and people say, oh, does it work for you? I'm like, well, if you believe anything can work for you, it's just having that belief and the hope and holding that, like you said, the light within, because nothing else will compare to the light and spark within you. 

ZOE: Definitely.

JENNIE: Oh Asta, that’s a lovely way to end it. Normally, I'm full of sarcasm and all the banter, but I have to say, that is a really nice way to end it. And I think I really hope there are people out there that are listening that hopefully can look at your story. And Zoe, she mentions in other podcasts, Zoe has 24 hour care and all the issues that you have with that as well, Zoe, and have some hope. And it's just to remind everybody out there, really, look, we're here if you ever want to write in to us, we've got the Love Lounge. We're here, we're listening, we're here to support you.

ASTA: Yeah, I'm fully on board with the Love Lounge, actually, by the way. I love it. I think it's incredible what you've set up, and I only wish that something like that was around when I was starting out in my journey, because it just needs someone to say, doesn't it, this is what you can do and it's going to be all right. 

JENNIE: Yeah, brilliant. Well, thank you so much. Thanks so much for taking time out to come and chat to us. I really appreciate it. 

ASTA: It’s an absolute pleasure.

JENNIE: Thank you so much for listening. For more information, you can find us @enhancetheuk.org on Instagram at etukundressing, twitter etukundressing. We look forward to seeing you soon.